I’ve seen a lot of crap lately about how pro-lifers believe that rape is God’s will. No we don’t. Some do, but a lot of us believe thats totally wrong. Rape is horrible. Rape is a sin. God does not plan or will for someone to get raped. I don’t believe that. Rape is 100% the fault of the rapist and is WRONG and NOT PART OF GOD’S PLAN. We have free will. God gave us free will. Some people completely abuse their free will and treat other people horribly.
That being said, I still don’t believe abortion is acceptable even in cases of rape. It is not the baby’s fault the rape happened. Don’t make the baby into a victim too. Two wrongs do not make a right.
So you are willing to force someone to go through PTSD, being violated again and again by the rapist, having the control of their body taken away against their will every day for the next 9+ months after that traumatic incident?
We’re not “punishing the baby”. We’re helping the mother- PTSD is very real, very dangerous, and very deadly.
No exceptions for rape, hunh? So I have an idea. For every unwanted embryo you want to save, why don’t we force you down, and implant them into your body? You dont get a say on how it gets there, nor the outcome. Any takers?
Not to mention that the rapist, even if he’s been tried AND convicted, which is a tiny little fraction of rapists, still has custody rights on a child that is born and can and will use that to torture the rape victim (or even black mail her into refusing to press charges on him), rape her again, and possibly hurt the children. Being found with marijuana means losing your kids, but apparently if you violently rape someone you’re still pretty safe to be around children. Apparently.
So tell me some more about how rape victims need to just continue that rape for their entire lives by being forced to carry and raise a child they never wanted? The only thing YOU want seems to be for that rape victim to suffer as much as humanly possible!
A pregnant 16-year-old in the Dominican Republic died from complications of leukemia, according to CNN. The young woman was forced to wait nearly three weeks to begin chemotherapy to treat her disease as hospital officials initially refused to treat her fearing it could terminate her pregnancy. In the end she lost her life and the pregnancy, and may have died because of the delay in her treatment.
Under an amendment to the Dominican Republic’s constitution which declares that “life begins at conception,” abortion is banned, effectively for any reason. The girl’s leukemia was diagnosed when she was just nine weeks pregnant.
Dominican women’s health advocates told RH Reality Check this afternoon that while the doctors and the state refused to allow the girl treatment for leukemia, they made her undergo “ultrasounds to show that the baby was healthy and for her to see it moving.”
This is fucking horrible, and we could see a lot more headlines like this if the pro-life movement had their way.
What’s so “pro-life” about letting the mother and the fetus die?
But the point is that the baby was born and now has been given life…oh…wait…no…they’re both dead now.
Pro-lifers, I want you to bask in this because this is what you want. This is your fault so own it. Stand up and take responsibility and be proud about what you’ve accomplished in this case: a dead 16-year-old girl and a dead fetus and a grieving family.
How can someone stand behind abortion, when you have a life inside of you that God created for you? How can you say that this life isn’t worth it? If you can’t take care of the baby for whatever circumstances than there is always adoption available to couples who can’t conceive, but still want the joy of being parents. OPEN YOUR EYES! God has bigger plans for us all that we don’t even realize the picture.
Excuse me but it appears your baby is actually upside down
Did you take Sex Ed freshman year because babies come out headfirst
Hi, OP! As someone who was given up for adoption, allow me to call bullshit on your little post there! You see, when I was adopted, I was a white-skinned, healthy, neurotypical infant, which basically put me at the top of the list, right underneath white-skinned, healthy, neurotypical MALE infants! There’s only one kind of infant people wanted to adopt more than me! I was SOOO lucky! But if you actually bothered to look at the information readily available on the interwebs, you would be aware that the majority of people who are forced to rely on abortion for family planning are poor people and people of color. Of course, those two demographics intersect, thanks to the institutionalized racism of our society! Neat huh?!
Of course, even babies of color are not in high demand with couples looking to adopt. Many who do want to adopt outside their race choose to go outside the country, where laws are less strict and the process is often less expensive. Of course, most of the infants adopted this way are obtained in unscrupulous fashion, but who cares about that when you’re saving a little Korean or African baby from the horrible fate of growing up in Korea or Africa??? And all those children who have birth defects, are born with diseases or disabilities, or have other issues… WELL. Who wants to invest that kind of expense and time? Why would you adopt someone broken, LOLOL?!
Granted, there are some wonderful people who understand the system a little better, and make it a point to try and give POC and disabled children a good home. But they make up a very small fraction of potential adopters! This difference in supply and demand leaves a lot of children stuck in the foster system, where their chances of being adopted diminish with every passing year, and their chances of being physically or sexually abused INCREASE! Isn’t that wonderful?
And of course, we haven’t even talked about the person who is giving birth to the baby! I know you probably think pregnancy is a wonderful, happy time, and for some people it is, but it is also one of the greatest health risks a person can take. I love my son very much, and from the day I found out I was pregnant with him, I wanted him! But I also nearly died giving birth to him. You see, I had pre-eclampsia, the most commonly fatal birth complication in the world. My blood pressure was 180 over 130! At twenty-two years old, I was actually headed for a stroke, hah hah! How funny is that? And all it took was missing a single pre-natal appointment during which my blood pressure rose to dangerous levels and my body tried to kill both me and my son. Those seizures sure were fun, as was the emergency c-section performed without anesthetic! And being chained down while the operation was performed, because I was delirious and wouldn’t stop trying to fight off the doctors, that was a BLAST! It was great for my husband too, since he almost lost his wife and child in just forty-five minutes. You can imagine how thrilled he is at the prospect of me ever getting pregnant again. Babies are certainly cute, but pregnancy can have massive health complications, and I know it’s such a bummer, but they are PERMANENT. :( My abdominal muscles never recovered from being hacked through with a scalpel, and the flood of hormones caused by late pregnancy have changed things from heartburn (never used to have it, now, all the time!) to my emotional reactions (I cry when I see pictures of kittens now. I used to be tough). These are changes I did not ask for, cannot control, and cannot fix! And many people go through worse! I know, right? Unbelievable, but go look up the word ‘episiotomy’ and then look up ‘birth rape’ and I’m afraid you’ll find some stuff that just isn’t very shiny. Plus, the studies actually show that people who carry a baby to term, give birth, then give it up for adoption suffer HIGHER rates of post-pregnancy complications like post-partum depression and post-partum psychosis, general depression, and other mental health issues. Adoption actually isn’t good for the person giving birth at all!
I’m afraid the picture you chose to use there is also pretty disingenuous. I know, I know, it seems like nitpicking. I’m not trying to be mean! :( But that picture shows a fully developed, viable infant, and most abortions are performed when the fetus isn’t even a fetus - it’s a blastocyst. That’s just a clump of cells. Seriously! You can totally find pictures on the interwebs and they’re not even gross, LOLOL! Later-term abortions are usually performed because of health complications, though some of our intrepid state legislators are trying to change all that! They care so much about people who are pregnant, you see, that they want to force them to carry dead or dying fetuses inside them until their body either becomes infected while it rots in their tummies (this is called sepsis, and it makes people very sick, and can even kill them!), or forces it out naturally in a gush of blood and fluids! Isn’t that so caring of them? I’m so glad they’re around to make those decisions for me! And if a pregnant person is not allowed to terminate an unviable fetus, in some states, they have to carry the child to term, give birth to it, and then watch it die in their arms because its lungs weren’t developed, or its brain formed outside its skull, or any of a million possible birth defects that will kill you just as quick as lickity-split! Isn’t that wild?! Of course, these people go through terrible grief, and as I mentioned, some of them may get sick and die from not being able to abort dead or dying fetuses. But I guess that’s just A-okay with you, huh?
Basically, I think before you suggest adoption as a universal alternative, you should actually go do some research on adoption. And before you condemn abortion, you should do some research on abortions - not the stuff your church is giving you, the stuff the real doctors are saying. Go to Planned Parenthood (if they haven’t all been closed down, ROFLMAO!) and request whatever information they have on the process, the statistics of who has abortions and why… and actually, all of that is on the interwebs! Isn’t technology AMAZING?
And in closing, since I’ve been asked this question many times and I know it’s coming? Yes, I realize I am here talking to you because I was not aborted. But the thing is, if my mother had chosen abortion, I wouldn’t know the difference, so it wouldn’t matter to me. And if she decided that choice was best for her, then that choice would have been best for her, and I would never want to take that choice away from her. As it is, since I was given up for adoption, and since I have seen the statistics on how badly people who give their children up for adoption suffer, I have spent much of my adult life worrying about her, whether she’s healthy, whether she’s okay, and feeling that if she did suffer from any of the common post-birth symptoms, it is at least partially my fault, even though she made that decision on her own. Which is silly, I know, but at some point, all children have to stare down the consequences of their parents’ having them. For some, that’s poverty. For others, a life-time of their parents struggling to treat and care for a severe illness or disability. For others, it’s wondering if their mother ever got over giving them away, and wishing you could reach out and assure her that it’s okay, she doesn’t have to be haunted.
May your birth control never fail!
A senior Vatican cleric has defended the excommunication of the mother and doctors of a nine-year-old girl who had an abortion in Brazil after allegedly being raped by her stepfather.
The regional archbishop, Jose Cardoso Sobrinho, pronounced excommunication for the mother for authorising the operation and doctors who carried it out for fear that the slim girl would not survive carrying the foetuses to term. [Not that you need a fucking excuse for giving a nine year old girl, a FUCKING NINE YEAR OLD GIRL WHO WAS RAPED, an abortion, because PREGNANCY WILL ALWAYS BE VERY FUCKING UNHEALTHY FOR A CHILD, that’s not even including the fucking psychological issues of being raped and having to give birth to rape babies WHEN YOU ARE STILL A BABY YOURSELF]
He also said the accused stepfather would not be expelled from the church. Although the man allegedly committed “a heinous crime … the abortion - the elimination of an innocent life - was more serious”. [Saving a girl’s life and health is apparently worse than being a rapist, but then forgiveness of rapists is actually extremely common amongst Christianity, with the Vatican being the prime example itself.]
The girl, who was not identified because she is a minor, was last week found to be four months pregnant after being taken to hospital suffering stomach pains.
Officials said she told them she had suffered sexual abuse by her stepfather since the age of six.
Police said the 23-year-old stepfather also allegedly sexually abused the girl’s physically handicapped 14-year-old sister.
In case you ever forget it: All anti-choicers are scum to me, without question.
When Nebraska Governor Dave Heineman signed the country’s first 20 week abortion ban back in 2010, he was eager to prove his stripes as a “pro-life” legislator.
That same session, he also vetoed Medicaid funds that would provide prenatal care for undocumented pregnant women, saying he couldn’t support any taxpayer dollars going to illegal immigrants, despite the fact that their children would in fact be citizens of the country.
When the unicameral legislature originally enacted the ban, they soon tried to find other ways to fund prenatal care for undocumented women rather than through taxpayer funds after learning how dire the consequences could be for the babies if a woman didn’t have access to health care. They were told about a “4 percent death rate during the first year of life for those babies whose mothers had no prenatal care at all. The high death rate has many factors, including that mothers who don’t get prenatal care may be less likely to take their children to doctors after birth. But prenatal care does play a role,” too, the health expert informed them.
Still Heineman’s threat to veto any bill that tried to get funding to these women kept the politicians at bay. This, despite the fact that doctors were reporting women who were choosing to have abortions rather than continue their pregnancies because they couldn’t afford prenatal care.
Now, two years later, the state legislature is once more fighting to bring back prenatal care, and they have a near veto proof majority to make it happen. And the governor, angry, is calling out fellow anti-abortion Republican legislators for putting healthy pregnancies and babies over the state’s strict anti-immigrant stance.
Vowing that he won’t let the state become a “magnet for illegal aliens,” Heineman is attacking bill sponsor Mike Flood, one of the most staunch anti-choice politicians in the state. “Unless you and the Legislature reverse course, the legacy of this session will be one in which illegals were given preferential treatment over legal Nebraska citizens…This will be a session remembered for a tax increase on legal, working Nebraskan men and women while illegal aliens were provided taxpayer-funded benefits.”
The restoration of funding passed at exactly the same number of votes needed to override a veto. If Heineman can pull off just one legislator, he can deny the funds again, and he is anxious to make that happen.
Can we really believe that politicians are “pro-life” when they are willing to sacrifice babies in order to deny health care to undocumented pregnant women? When they are so anxious to keep immigrants out of their state that they would rather see women abort than have babies? And especially when those babies would then get citizenship?
By Christina Caron
Oct 28, 2011 3:17pm
The Man Behind Mississippi’s Abortion Debate
On Nov. 8 Mississippi voters will decide whether a fertilized egg should be considered a “person,” a movement organized by Christian activist and “part-time farmer and tractor salesman” Les Riley who chairs an organization advocating for constitutional rights.
Riley’s proposed amendment to Mississippi’s state constitution, Measure 26, would define personhood as “every human being from the moment of fertilization, cloning or the functional equivalent thereof.”
The conservative activist, who has 10 children, submitted the proposed initiative in 2009, gathering more than 100,000 signatures in support of the measure.
“The gay rights people say they’re the end of the civil rights movement — they’re it,” he said at a 2009 Tea Party rally where he plugged the petition. “The only people who don’t have civil rights in this country are the tiny people.”
“You cannot escape living in a religious society,” Riley told the crowd. During the speech he described President Barack Obama as a “boogeyman” and an “open socialist” and Bill Clinton as a “bad guy.”
The American Civil Liberties Union of Mississippi and Planned Parenthood filed a lawsuit, arguing that the amendment would modify the Bill of Rights by defining what a “person” is, but the Mississippi Supreme Court allowed the initiative to stay on the ballot.
During the 2009 rally, Riley thanked anti-abortion activist Cal Zastrow, someone who was working “fulltime” to get the personhood amendment on the ballot.
“When he’s not doing that he’s down at the abortion clinic counseling mothers and when he’s not doing that he’s smuggling Bibles into communist countries,” said Riley, who was not immediately available today for comment.
Zastrow has also volunteered with the personhood campaign in Colorado, which was defeated by voters twice.
In Mississippi, however, the measure appears to have more support.
Riley currently serves as chairman of the Mississippi Constitution Party, an organization that believes, “The sole purpose of government, as stated in the Declaration of Independence, is to secure our unalienable rights given us by our Creator. When Government grows beyond this scope, it is usurpation, and liberty is compromised.”
Even so, the “personhood” amendment would create additional governmental control.
The proposition’s website, YesOn26, says the amendment would “stop the abortion industry in Mississippi” even in cases of rape or incest, because “women who have borne a child conceived in rape testify that the baby is a blessing.”
It would also challenge the Roe v. Wade ruling, something Riley considers “judicial tyranny.”
The 1973 Supreme Court decision was based on the Constitutional right to privacy in the Due Process clause of the Fourteenth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution.
Critics worry the vague wording of the “personhood” amendment would carry serious implications, creating a rationale for banning certain types of contraception or making doctors subject to criminal prosecution.
But Riley dismisses those concerns as just another example of the “incredible opposition” posed by abortion rights advocates.
“[Pro-abortion groups] know Mississippi is among the most pro-life states & that we have put these convictions into action over the past two decades – closing six of the seven abortion mills that were in our state at one time,” Riley wrote in a 2010 article on website TheAmericanReview.com. “Now we only have one struggling abortion mill left in the state. Having worked to protect all children by love, we can now protect them again in law.”
[click to see video]
This is pro-life. This is a leader of a pro-life movement. This is a representation of that movement. And, as pro-choicers have been saying all along. He is erasing pregnant people, he is completely dismissive of their liberty (because apparently who cares if actual people’s liberties are compromised, what about the embryo/fetus?), bodily autonomy, lives (because there’s no mention of women who don’t think being raped or sexually abused was a ‘blessing’ and would be even further traumatized by being forced to give birth to their rapist’s child but fuck them apparently. Horrible crime inflicted on you? Blessing in disguise of course), and well being. He wants a law put into place that will, in fact, oppress pregnant people, with the goal of making sure they have no options other than forced birth and pregnancy. Tyranny over them is fine though, I guess, is what the message is. He is anti-choice. Pro-life is anti-choice. This is disgusting.
You know, it’s a real piss off when people have sex and expect not to have a baby. I mean, are you serious?
Yes. It’s called contraception. I don’t know if you’re aware of this, but people have sex for reasons other than procreation. In fact, the majority of sex is done for pleasure and without the intent of getting pregnant.
Your gonna let some guy have his way with you, and expect nothing to happen? come on.
That’s a terribly sexist and depressing view of sex.
Then, you decide to kill an innocent life, that you have no right to kill. Sometimes, i wish we still lived back in the 17th century when a woman who got pregnant, HAD to have the kid. Maybe then it will make you think twice about doing it ignorantly.
How progressive and compassionate of you. Should we stop wearing pants and voting too?
I really think abortion needs to be made illegal because, no offence, but if you think that way, then you shouldn’t have had sex. If you didn’t want to risk having a child, then you shouldn’t have fucked. I don’t care how much you say you “love” someone. If you don’t want to take responsibility of having a child, it’s called fucking.
The “you did this, now suffer for it” argument has so many problems. I wish they’d stop using it. It’s really just tiresome and sad.
And way to tell people that their love isn’t real. What, are you a mind reader now?
Oh, and another thing: If your stupid enough to actually *let* a guy talk you into having a child, when your clearly not ready to, then you need to dump his ass. Either that, or grow some brain cells of your own.
Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. Um… don’t women at least occasionally decide to have kids on purpose? Isn’t it a stereotype that the woman is the one trying to talk the man into it?
If your going to let someone dictate your life to you, then you need to actually find someone who knows what there doing. That right there, is what gives guys everywhere a bad name, just because some of you girls let some tom, dick and harry, with a 9th grade IQ rule your life. I swear, the stupidity of the human race never ceases to amaze me with it’s asinine ways.
"You know, it’s a real piss off when people have sex and expect not to have a baby. I mean, are you serious?"
It really pisses me off when other people think they can dictate what other people do what their bodies and do in their sex lives. Anti-choicers do it all the time. Are you seriously so fucking arrogant? x.x
The rest is just straight up woman-hating and a really creepy emphasis on wanting to control other people. And..
"Oh, and another thing: If your stupid enough to actually *let* a guy talk you into having a child, when your clearly not ready to, then you need to dump his ass. Either that, or grow some brain cells of your own."
Victims of reproductive coercion are stupid apparently, and also all abusive relationships are solved really simply and easily. Super easy to get out of.. always. Guess we had to throw in some victim blaming too, this is some vile shit.
I’m reblogging this so people know to avoid this patchx66 person.
This showed up on my newsfeed today.
I have a couple of things to say about it…
- A pregnancy that far along is very unlikely to be aborted for personal reasons. A pregnancy that far along would probably only be terminated because of fetal abnormalities or the mother’s life.
- NO fetus would be that large or that well developed during pregnancy. That picture is ridiculously medically inaccurate. It is very clearly a baby.
- In pregnancy that far along the fetuses head would be faced down towards the vaginal opening in preparation for delivery.
I would appreciate it if anti-choicers would stop with the ridiculous inaccuracies, and use facts instead. Oh wait, they can’t…facts don’t really favor them…
this is what I hate about pro-life campaigns. they are never accurate. but I also don’t appreciate the whole “oh wait, they can’t…facts don’t really favor them…” bullshit. because there are some of us who DO have facts. the problem is, we’re a minority of those who are anti-abortion. so many people who are pro-life are simply pro-life because of religion or ethics or whatever. and while yes, I do agree that part of my argument is based on my ethics, I also have facts to back up my argument.
I think that people on both sides of the spectrum need to either get some facts or shut the fuck up, and let intelligent people do the arguing.
Oh interesting, you claim to have facts supporting an anti-choice argument but than you don’t give me any…
If you want some facts here is my personal favorite:
- While abortion was illegal an estimated 200,000 to 1.2 million illegal abortions were performed per year. Resulting in the deaths of around 5,000 people per year.
I don’t know what sort of “fact” you can give me that would justify the deaths of all those people…
It never ceases to amaze me that pro-lifers think people are aborting full-term healthy pregnancies. -Jess
Bolded for emphasis. Iamateenagefeminist is pretty awesome!
Because slavery and abortion are completely the same u guise.
Really? Really???? FUCKING REALLY?????
Did you pay attention in history class? Did you fail history? Did you even go to your history class???? Slavery IS IN NO WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM LIKE ABORTION! Get off the internet and go read a book!
ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME?
You want to talk about slavery, yet you also want to conveniently forget the lived realities of FEMALE slaves. You know, the whole forced birth via white master rapists thing? Reproductive coercion: that’s a big fucking part of slavery dumbass. Then there was the whole forced sterilization, testing birth control pills on WOC, laws against inter-racial marriages, creation of the black welfare queen/crack baby stereotypes after slavery ended. Do you see a pattern here? No? Well I’ll spell it out for you: women of color have historically had very little control over their reproduction because of people just like you. Now that they do have some semblance of reproductive rights you’re going to take them away under the guise of caring about fucking slavery by returning to the practice of forced birth?!
Rachel Maddow schools Mitt Romney in her man cave on how babies are made and how birth control prevents that because clearly he missed health class thirty years ago, or he’s too busy with the pursuit of his ego to to think about something that affects 51% of the people he “wants” to represent
This is beautiful.
I just need to say that I love her.
I fucking love Rachel Maddow.
This video is GREAT. I HIGHLY recommend you all watch it. Not because Rachel Maddow schools Mitt Romney’s ass HARD but because it shows WHY comprehensive sex education is important.
It is important to understand what conception is and what a pregnancy is and how those are related. Apparently this is something that is being neglected if a presidential candidate doesn’t even understand it.
I also just want to point out that bills that attempt to give personhood to fertilized eggs are inherently sexist. There are no FDA approved hormonal birth control options for cis-men so the only people these bills hurt are people with vaginas. Not only that but these bills aren’t just outlawing hormonal birth control, they are forcing people with vaginas to use more unreliable methods of birth control like the pull-out method, natural family planning, or diaphragms and cervical caps if condoms aren’t or can’t be used.
AND, if a person becomes pregnant because they were forced to use a cervical cap that is 80% effective rather than the birth control they were taking that was 99.9% effective, they can be put in JAIL if the fertilized egg does not implant or if they have a miscarriage.
These are the consequences of bills like this. A person who suffers a miscarriage does not need to be carted off to jail; they need compassion and empathy and support.